4 paintings to be mounted, some newby questions + requests

Questions and answers about our artwork mounting. See a tour of our artwork mounting workshop.
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pauld
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4 paintings to be mounted, some newby questions + requests

Post by pauld » Feb 19, 2009 7:55 am

Hi Gary
First, Let me say I'm so glad I found this site and your mounting business.

I’m a painter in Sweden, exclusively paint on xuanzhi, or occasionally Japanese equivalents. Lived previously in Xiamen and then Taiwan, had paintings mounted there and sent things for mounting, but have lost touch with those mounters.
I am enclosing digital pix, 4 ptgs plus one already mounted as example.

I have some special requirements that I would like to run past you - nothing major but I need to know if it works for you, as I have a backlog I will also want mounted later on after this first small batch.

- I would like as plain a silk as possible. I managed to find silk without any pattern at all once, but that might be difficult.
- Color is not so important, but toned down and lighter. Cream for example is fine.
- No black linear border around the image.
- Sometimes non-standard dimensions/orientations for the scroll (I will indicate the dimensions or deviations from standard, or "standard" meaning as you would normally mount a vertical painting or calligraphy).
- Sometimes scroll not necessary, just mounting (I will indicate).
- Also, I can communicate directly with the mounter in Beijing in written Chinese, by email, if that helps, I mean if questions arise. For that matter can call (Skype to his landline) and communicate in spoken Chinese if that helps.

So, 4 uploads for mounting and an example not for mounting, just to show the "no black border".

Too many special requests? Comments?

Regards,
Paul
Attachments
swirlyPlus3trees_AlreadyMountedCloseupA.JPG
EXAMPLE, not for mounting
(151.68 KiB) Downloaded 83 times
crowDrink.JPG
scroll, standard
(99.2 KiB) Downloaded 83 times
crowWalkLeft.JPG
scroll, standard
(150.59 KiB) Downloaded 83 times
magpieBread.JPG
scroll, short if possible due to horizontal orientation of image
(54.62 KiB) Downloaded 83 times
moored.JPG
scroll, standard
(96.43 KiB) Downloaded 83 times

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Gary
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Post by Gary » Feb 19, 2009 4:08 pm

We have traditional white (actually more like cream-colored) silk with no pattern.

If you can write your instructions in Chinese, that will save a big step in the process. Any artwork mounted to a vertical or horizontal scroll with the small edge being 33cm or less is US$20.00

Because you talked about non-standard orientation, let me clarify that the edge of the artwork that we will measure is the edge that is parallel to the scroll roller. It's actually the length of the roller that most effects the price/cost (especially shipping).

The fee we bill for shipping is $15.80 for the first wall scroll, and $4.80 for each additional wall scroll shipped together. This is for SAL postage (2-4 weeks). Faster service is available for extra cost.

Here's the address:

李鸿亮
北京市通州区梨园镇翠屏北里18号楼111室
北京 101121
中国 P.R.CHINA

Try to fill out your customs paper work as "gift" and either "hand-painted Chinese calligraphy" or "hand painted Chinese artwork". This will suggest that the origin of the artwork is China, and keep any import tax or duties from being levied. We'll send it back to you as a "returned goods" (or gift) so you won't see any VAT or duties on your end.

-Gary.
Last edited by Gary on Apr 8, 2010 3:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

pauld
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Ready to send paintings

Post by pauld » Apr 15, 2009 10:16 pm

OK, Finally getting around to sending the paintings.
Here are the Chinese instructions for Mr. Li.
I have asked him to add 30 50 50 sheets of xuanzhi on returning the mounted paintings and add it to the bill (hard to get here in Sweden). Will that be OK?
Any last comments or instructions for me?

亲爱的李鸿亮裱画師,
我送给你4张画.情你弄好裱这些画。
已经给过Gary 关于这些画儿的详情。
有一些特别的小要求。我希望不太麻烦你。

将来我想再送给你画儿裱,这些说明也是对于将来送的有关。

第一 - 纸
大部分的画儿是在一般的宣纸画的。有时候一些是在日本来的纸但是不应该有问题裱。

第二 - 绢
不要花绫的(patterned)绢. 耿绢(plain)比较好。
Gary 说你们有一种简单的绢,灰白色的或黄褐色的。
我比较喜欢简单的颜色,简单的装饰。

第三 - 不要环绕画心的黑线。

第四 - 画心外面的比例。标准的就好,或者按照你的专业判断。如果我将来对于一张有特别的要求的话我就会表明。

第五 -画杆
我有时要裱画但是不要用画杆 - 我就自己来访那张在西方式的框。这时没有那种。如果我将来有我就会表明,也应该把画心外面的比例使适应为框。

第六 - 怎么剪掉
有时候几张画不是完全矩形。我就请你用你的专业判断决定怎么剪掉。但是我比较喜欢包括个个角,甚而画张不是完全满画心。

第七 - 我快就没有宣纸。在瑞典不容易买。你回送给我裱好的画儿可以也包括30-50张宣纸在相同的包里面?请你告诉GARY宣纸的价格,他会增加我的帐单.

谢谢
戴波
Paul DeVries
Norrhultsv. 74
36071 Norrhult
Sweden 瑞典
paul.devries@whitepine.se

pauld
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package in the mail

Post by pauld » Apr 16, 2009 12:45 pm

package in the mail, from Sweden to Beijing

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Gary
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Post by Gary » Apr 16, 2009 2:31 pm

Got it, and I am forwarding your message to Beijing.

-G.

pauld
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thanks ...

Post by pauld » Apr 16, 2009 8:30 pm

and the instructions are also printed out and in the package for Mr. Li.
If he has email and any questions arise he can mail me directly if he wants.

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Post by Gary » Apr 27, 2009 2:27 pm

Your package arrived in Beijing.

I had forwarded your instructions to Li Hong in Beijing, but I didn't read most of it.

Seems there's a lot of confusion about those instructions. As with any business field, there is certain language used just in that field (the medical field is a good example). Asian artwork mounting is no different. We tried to go through your Chinese instructions, but the result was far more questions than answers. Li Hong suggested that you tell me what you want in English so that I can translate it with my partner in to a more clear set of instructions in "Chinese artwork mounting language". That's what we usually do, and it works pretty well (I think we've only made a mistake once in hundreds of projects doing it that way).

Cheers,
-Gary.

pauld
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english text, mounting notes

Post by pauld » Apr 28, 2009 1:56 am

Hi Gary,
Sorry about the bad Chinese. I'll stick to English in the future. (Was working from my Taiwanese mounting manual, and as you see with pretty limited Chinese).

1. Paper - most of the paintings are on Chinese xuanzhi, some might be on some Japanese papers but should not be a problem.

2. The silk, as we discussed, the plain, non-patterned silk you have that you indicated was off-white. Or any light color that Mr. Li deems appropriate. Generally, a simpler mounting style is preferred.

3. No black border around the painting, please.

4. Proportions of the mounting, top and bottom. Standard, or according to Mr. Li's judgement. Occasionally in the future I might have a request for a non-standard proportion, especially if I plan to not scroll-mount, in which case I will indicate that.

5. Sometimes in the future not scroll-mounted (no rollers) since I will mount myself in a flat frame. Proportion of the mounting will then be appropriate for frame (square, not long vertical).

6. Clipping. Sometimes the painting is not on a perfectly rectangular piece of paper. In that case rather than severly clipping, if possible I would prefer to have the entire painting included in it's slightly non-rectangular form, with the backing paper showing in some corner a bit. (I realise as I write this now that this is kind of a vague instruction, so if it's a problem don't worry - a) I won't complain whatever you do and b) if it's really a problem in the future I will clip the paintings myself to a perfect rectangle. Let me know.)

7. Would it be possible to include 30-50 sheets of standard quality xuanzhi in the return package and bill me? It's hard to get xuanzhi in Sweden. If not, no problem.

Thanks. Apologies again for the confusing Chinese instructions.

regards,
Paul

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Gary
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Post by Gary » Apr 30, 2009 3:37 pm

Got it...

For the xuan paper supply that you want... Should that be beige (natural), or any certain color or texture (there is a wide variety). Oh, and do you want it cooked (sized) or raw?

For a standard quality, it's about $1 per 68cm x 134cm sheet. Good quality is $1.50 - $2.00 per sheet. Some special papers are even more.

-Gary.

pauld
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Post by pauld » Apr 30, 2009 4:41 pm

Hi
Xuan paper:
- beige (natural)
- raw
- a little better quality then, 1.50-2/sheet
Paul

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Gary
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Post by Gary » May 6, 2009 5:56 pm

One more question that I was supposed to ask last time. There is a bird painting that is in horizontal format. Do you still want this on a vertical wall scroll? Other options would be a horizontal wall scroll or a portrait mount.

-Gary.

pauld
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Bird painting, vertical wall scroll

Post by pauld » May 6, 2009 9:18 pm

Bird painting, vertical wall scroll, please.

-Paul

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paintings arrived, time to pay?

Post by pauld » Jun 2, 2009 8:13 am

Hi Gary,
Paintings arrived, look great. Time to pay I think. Haven't seen a bill yet, or have I missed something?
Regards,
Paul

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Post by Gary » Jun 5, 2009 5:33 pm

Hey buddy.

We got a little ahead of ourselves and shipped your package out early.

Here's the price breakdown:

Your scrolls took special instructions and special materials (that plain white silk is expensive stuff). So we'll make them $30 each ($120 total for the 4 of them).

The paper was 50 sheets @ $1.50 = $75

Shipping via air mail was nearly $50 (adding the box and paperwork fees, I am sure it was at least $50 total).

You can pay for that by adding this "dummy item" to your cart and checking out from our website:
http://www.orientaloutpost.com/proddeta ... cms4-paper

Or you can send US$245.00 via paypal to

Cheers,
-Gary.

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Post by Gary » Jun 7, 2009 10:37 am

Thanks for the fast payment!

By the way, we are not taking any new customers for artwork mounting right now. But, you count as an "established artwork mounting customer", and are welcome to submit more artwork for mounting in the future.

Cheers,
-Gary.

pauld
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plain, non-pattered silk, another color

Post by pauld » Jul 1, 2009 1:39 am

Hi Gary
Later this summer I will get together another set of paintings for mounting. I really appreciate you keeping me on 'active' status for this service despite having in principle discontinued it.

My question, the off-white silk is fine, but optimal would be one with more of a tone, any tone really, although best ia a very pale yellowish-tan or rose-tan (see submitted example of already mounted in earlier post) - would it be possible for me to purchase an entire bolt of this silk, which would then be used exclusively for my paintings? (I 'm planning a more or less steady if low-volume stream of paintings, as long as your service exists anyway!)

What would the approximate cost be?

I understand if this is too irregular a request, in which case the white silk would be fine.

Regards
Paul

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Gary
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Post by Gary » Jul 1, 2009 10:39 am

I can ask Li Hong about that.

The plain silk varies from batch to batch. Sometimes it's pure white, but often it is more of a natural or cream color.

Thinking out of the box here: If we used backing xuan paper of a different hue behind the white silk, I think we can change the whole perceived color hue. I should ask Li Hong about that, as he is the expert, and I am just the guy who gets him in trouble on things like this.

We don't have a lot of control over the tone of the silk we get. It seems the loom (factory) doesn't have control either. You can ask for exactly the same pattern and color as the last batch, but almost every time when the new batch arrives, it's just a little different (in hue/shade or pattern).

There are basically three factories that make "mounting silk" in all of China. One of then does not care, and will simply send out total crap, or completely wrong silk (wrong color, wrong pattern, or lower quality than ordered). Another is very slow (I think they wait until they have enough orders before they start a run on the loom). The last is reliable on delivery, but they are the ones with the variable tones and sometimes pattern.

The situation defies all logic. You would think in China of all places, you could get reliable mounting silk.

It should be noted that there are hundreds if not thousands of factories making silk cloth and silk products in China. But the silk used for artwork mounting is not the normal silk brocade (which is far too thick). This is a very thin and stable version that is only used for artwork mounting. Therefore it's a specialty product that you can't just find anywhere.

I've been battling this issue for 7 years now. In that time, I have written off dozens of bolts of incorrect or poor-quality runs of silk. Actually, we sell that bad silk off at a discount to other artwork mounting shops that make "tourist trash" wall scrolls.

FYI: Last time I checked, we're paying about $428 (3000 RMB) for 100 meters of silk.

I'd rather avoid the futile effort of trying to buy and reserve whole bolts of silk for you. Let's try some other options first, if you are just looking for a warmer tone of silk on your projects.

-Gary.

pauld
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Post by pauld » Jul 2, 2009 2:04 pm

Hi,
OK, let's forget the special silk. Sounds like you have enough complications on that score as it is.

How about this, when I send again I'll include a note (along with any other mounting notes) requesting more of a tone in the silk (or the backing xuan option you mention if that proves to be feasible and not a hassle for you or Li Hong), "if available". If not available at that time, no problem, the silk used on these latest paintings is fine.

Thanks
Paul

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Post by Gary » Jul 3, 2009 10:34 am

Sounds good. I will probably have him send me a sample so I can see how that comes out before we actually do your next project. I want to make sure it looks good before we commit.

-Gary.

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